Profiling in the Part Editor

Moderators: Jason Susnjara, Larry Epplin, Clint Buechlein, Scott G Vaal

User avatar
Kerry Fullington
Wizard Member
Posts: 4566
Joined: Mon, May 09 2005, 7:33PM
Company Name: ProSource of Amarillo
Country: UNITED STATES
Location: Amarillo, TX

Profiling in the Part Editor

Postby Kerry Fullington » Fri, May 28 2010, 6:54AM

Josh Rayburn's recent post about the Non Manifold Body brings me to ask this question.

Where can I get some detailed information about how profiling is supposed to work in the part editor. It seems (my perception) that the rules change here with every new version.

I would like to know what diameter a tool should be saved with and how to determine this.
I would like to know how to find the edge of the part being profiled and which direction to run the profile tool.
I would like to know how the different compensation work and why we would need them if a tool is created properly.

My perception is that if a tool is created properly with the correct diameter assigned you should be able to select the tool and properly profile an edge without any plunge settings or compensations. You should only have to use plunge and compensation settings to modify the original profile.

I would like to know what a non manifold body is and what causes this error.

I have been using this feature since the beginning and I still don't understand it. It seems with each new version I have to play with things to make them work as they did in the previous version. I don't want "play" with this any more, I would like to truly learn it so I don't waste so much time here.

The profile tools are wonderful but that section of the part editor is confusing to say the least. I think I understand eCabinets pretty well and I have never been able to master this area. It is time that I did.

Pleas lead me to any "Detailed" information about how this works.

Kerry

User avatar
Gary Puckett
Wizard Member
Posts: 1324
Joined: Mon, May 19 2008, 1:39PM
Company Name: The Woodworkery
Location: Saint Charles, Missouri
Contact:

Re: Profiling in the Part Editor

Postby Gary Puckett » Fri, May 28 2010, 7:22AM

Kerry,

I don't think the dia. of the tool is an issue as much as the off set from X0 Y0 you draw the tool at.
I agree the part editor is a confusing area, and in my opinion one way to make it easier is to have the ability of rotating the part to get to the edge you want to work on.


Gary
HP Pavilion
Vista home Premium 64bit S. pack 2
AMD Phenom-X4
9850 Quad-Core Processor
6.0GB/Go Memory
1 TB/To Hard Drive
Nividia GeForce 9800 GT

User avatar
Josh Rayburn
eCabinets Beta Tester
Posts: 1262
Joined: Wed, Jul 01 2009, 2:19PM
Company Name: Halls Edge Inc
Country: UNITED STATES
Location: Stamford, CT USA
Contact:

Re: Profiling in the Part Editor

Postby Josh Rayburn » Fri, May 28 2010, 9:35AM

Kerry,
You took the words right out of my mouth. I would also be greatly interested in some further insight!!
Thanks!
jnr
Josh Rayburn
Hall's Edge, Inc.
CNC Machining Service


Dell Precision T3400
Win7 Professional 64 Bit/Core2Duo E8400 3ghz/4 GB Ram/NVIDIA Quadro FX570

Joe Dusel
eCabinets Beta Tester
Posts: 1117
Joined: Tue, May 17 2005, 9:40PM
Location: Vista, CA, U.S.A.
Contact:

Re: Profiling in the Part Editor

Postby Joe Dusel » Sun, May 30 2010, 10:15AM

I am confused Kerry. I am assuming that you read the Help Manual for these topics, and most of what you asked seems to be pretty well explained in there. The Help Manual sections on "Part Editor - Tool Selection" and "Part Editor - Profile Edge" seem to cover most of the questions you asked. Am I missing something?

As for the non manifold body I have no idea. I asked about that last year when we were beta testing and did not get an answer.

Joe
CFT411 http://www.cft411.com
Intel i7 920 @ 2.67GHz, 6 GB RAM, Windows 7 64 bit, NVIDIA Geforce GT220 (1GB)

User avatar
Kerry Fullington
Wizard Member
Posts: 4566
Joined: Mon, May 09 2005, 7:33PM
Company Name: ProSource of Amarillo
Country: UNITED STATES
Location: Amarillo, TX

Re: Profiling in the Part Editor

Postby Kerry Fullington » Sun, May 30 2010, 6:22PM

Joe,

The last help files I looked at about this was eCabinets Made Easy and it just confused me. What I needed to know is that facing the direction of travel if the part is on the left you use right compensation.

It was also good to know that the tool diameter is usually just the tool shank. Since I don't cut on a router I am not worried about creating a tool that would work on the router so what I have been doing is create a tool that doesn't have or allow for a shank and I give that tool a 0" diameter. I create the tool so that it is set at the proper depth below Y-0 and now I don't have to set the depth or worry about which direction I am going because it doesn't need any compensation, it follows the centerline. (unless I want to modify the standard profile)

By knowing where the part is I shouldn't get compensation the wrong way which would cut through the part and cause the manifold body error.

You have answered all my questions.

Kerry

User avatar
Kerry Fullington
Wizard Member
Posts: 4566
Joined: Mon, May 09 2005, 7:33PM
Company Name: ProSource of Amarillo
Country: UNITED STATES
Location: Amarillo, TX

Re: Profiling in the Part Editor

Postby Kerry Fullington » Sun, May 30 2010, 8:05PM

It also helps that after all these years I realize that in the part editor eCabinets looks at things from the machines point of view. It needs to start with the cutter above the work piece and know the plunge depth. It needs to know the diameter of the tool shank and the compensations for it as well as additional compensations for tool wear etc. It needs to know if you want a conventional cut or a climb cut.

My needs are different, I have always looked at it from a modeling point of view. My goal is to add a profile to the edge of a board using the least number of mouse clicks,data entry and thought processes.

Kerry

Joe Dusel
eCabinets Beta Tester
Posts: 1117
Joined: Tue, May 17 2005, 9:40PM
Location: Vista, CA, U.S.A.
Contact:

Re: Profiling in the Part Editor

Postby Joe Dusel » Mon, May 31 2010, 9:58AM

Actually Kerry, I have also done what you do with the tool profiles being setup such that I don't need to adjust their height. I wish one of the Thermwood guys would chime in to let us know how exactly these get used with the machines. I do have stuff milled on Thermwood machines, so I would like to know how to use the profile settings to take full advantage of the milling capabilities.

I also use the profiles to act on the insides of parts as well as the edges. This is of course where the Additional Offsets Left and Right come in. And you need to know the direction of travel to determine whether to adjust left or right. If you are going from left to right on the top of a part, and you wanted to have a V groove 2" from the top side, you would need to set Additional Offsets Right to 2". Setting left instead of right would have the bit missing the part, so you get an error message, "The tool configuration you selected doesn't seem to cut into the part body". (I know you know all this already Kerry, but I just said it for those who don't.) I do think it would have been much better to use a directional arrow to indicate the direction rather than the red dot.

Joe
CFT411 http://www.cft411.com
Intel i7 920 @ 2.67GHz, 6 GB RAM, Windows 7 64 bit, NVIDIA Geforce GT220 (1GB)

User avatar
DanEpps
Wizard Member
Posts: 5852
Joined: Thu, Jul 28 2005, 10:18AM
Company Name: Dan Epps
Country: UNITED STATES
Location: Rocky Face GA

Re: Profiling in the Part Editor

Postby DanEpps » Tue, Jun 01 2010, 5:48AM

Does this help any? It is something I put together a while back to help explain how the Part Editor works.
Attachments
Part Editor Demystified.pdf
(56.7 KiB) Downloaded 72 times

User avatar
Kerry Fullington
Wizard Member
Posts: 4566
Joined: Mon, May 09 2005, 7:33PM
Company Name: ProSource of Amarillo
Country: UNITED STATES
Location: Amarillo, TX

Re: Profiling in the Part Editor

Postby Kerry Fullington » Tue, Jun 01 2010, 6:15AM

Thanks Dan,

what I was having trouble understanding was why we gave tools a diameter and then compensated for the diameter. If I created a tool that was 2" wide,I was giving it a diameter of 2". I was going by the cutter not the shank. Now I know that it is to allow for the shank of the tool for the machines benefit.

I was also having difficulty determining when the part was represented by the blue portion or the yellow in the view diagram of the profile. I now understand that and everything works as it should.

And they say you can't teach an old dog new tricks. :)

Kerry

User avatar
DanEpps
Wizard Member
Posts: 5852
Joined: Thu, Jul 28 2005, 10:18AM
Company Name: Dan Epps
Country: UNITED STATES
Location: Rocky Face GA

Re: Profiling in the Part Editor

Postby DanEpps » Tue, Jun 01 2010, 6:48PM

Yeah, I got the bruises on my forehead from trying to figure it out too.

Paul Huff
Junior Member
Posts: 95
Joined: Thu, May 19 2005, 12:32AM
Location: Lubbock, Texas

Re: Profiling in the Part Editor

Postby Paul Huff » Wed, Jun 02 2010, 12:34PM

I attended a short class at Thermwood about the profile modeler. They said that they liked the tool profiles defined above the stock (lowest point of the profile at 0 y axis) and in the center of the profile (0 x axis). I think the main reason for this is so the profile could be used on a center line operation.

When profiles are cut on the CNC they are usally made with ball nose and flat bottom bits. The ball nose bits would run up and down the profile stepping over less than a 1/32 each pass. So a wide profile could take a really long time to cut. I never figured out how to setup a bit with an actual profile to run in the profile modeler even though I knew it could be done. However we did this with DXF files without using eCabinets.

I hope this helps.

User avatar
Josh Rayburn
eCabinets Beta Tester
Posts: 1262
Joined: Wed, Jul 01 2009, 2:19PM
Company Name: Halls Edge Inc
Country: UNITED STATES
Location: Stamford, CT USA
Contact:

Re: Profiling in the Part Editor

Postby Josh Rayburn » Wed, Jun 09 2010, 2:22PM

I also was hoping for TWD to chime in here, and perhaps explain the various errors we have all seen in the part editor when attempting to profile unusual shapes. I'd love to hear their description of what a non-manifold body is, and what we have to do (specific to the ecabinets software) in order to avoid it.
There are a few other errors too - which I can't recall at the moment, but the next time one comes up, I'll see if I can post it and then it will be accurate.

Thanks!
jnr
Josh Rayburn
Hall's Edge, Inc.
CNC Machining Service


Dell Precision T3400
Win7 Professional 64 Bit/Core2Duo E8400 3ghz/4 GB Ram/NVIDIA Quadro FX570


Return to “eCabinet Systems Software”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 14 guests