New CN controller and Vr6

Discuss Thermwood 3-axis Machinery, Controller, and Software.

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Neville Bastian
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New CN controller and Vr6

Postby Neville Bastian » Tue, Dec 15 2009, 5:07AM

Have been having problems with parts being 2 mm oversize when cut on the Thermwood for the last few days. Its always on the one side of the bed the X side. Thought it was mechanical but when cut with data from a different non ecabinet source the sizes cut were correct.
Was going to try a older CN on the Thermwood but saw there was a new one today. Loaded that and tried the Ecabinet file and the parts from RC2 were 2mm smaller. Rebooted the Thermwood and re ran the parts. They were spot on. Ran a non Thermwood file. Parts were correct. Ran a TWD file from RC3 they were 2mm too big. Rebooted the Thermwood. Re ran same TWD file and the parts were perfect.

Not sure on the answer but would be interested if others are having the same result. If you aren't maybe you could come across this problem.
Have loaded Vrs 6 RC3 so maybe that will help with a better TWD? Untill then I think it will be a reboot before each TWD is loaded. Maybe there is something in the CN file that is not refreshing. The 2mm is a common edging thickness we use.

Lost a fair bit of time so will have to hit Justin for a bottle of Bourbon, seeing he has distilleries on his back door.

Dean just repeated this from the Beta forum so you know what I posted.

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Neville
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Larry Epplin
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Re: New CN controller and Vr6

Postby Larry Epplin » Tue, Dec 15 2009, 8:56AM

Looks like this is the same post that you have in the Beta forum. Please attach the Control Nesting export and eCabinet files so we can reproduce the issue.

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Neville Bastian
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Re: New CN controller and Vr6

Postby Neville Bastian » Wed, Dec 16 2009, 8:21PM

Hi Larry,
I have sent you the files via Daniel. They are about 7 meg.
We are getting around the problem by cutting things twice on ecabinets data.
We had to cut some post-formed top joins today using a masons mitre program that is in Gcode. Doug Gilford supplied this. This was cutting correctly first time and was size perfect. It seems we only have problems with Ecabinets data. Hopefully you duplicate this soon.

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Neville
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Thom Davies
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Re: New CN controller and Vr6

Postby Thom Davies » Wed, Dec 16 2009, 8:29PM

Hey Neville

Can you go back to V5.2 by any chance? Ive got beta V6 as well and wouldnt let it loose in production untill Full V6 came out. I know we need to try V6 and cutting but as day to day running can u get back to 5.2? Im just thinking of ur money here! U can always run test cabinets thou V6 Beta and cut them.

Just an idea i had.

Cheers

Thom Davies
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Neville Bastian
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Re: New CN controller and Vr6

Postby Neville Bastian » Wed, Dec 16 2009, 8:42PM

Hi Thom,
Yes good point. I have been blaming the CN but it could be 6. I dismissed this because other people have been cutting data with no issues. Will try a job using 5.2 and let you know. WE have checked the part sizes in Control nesting and they are spot on though till you cut them. First time wobbly edge and over size second time perfect. Go figure that one.

Its the Murphy Law of cabinetmakers. Machinery always stuffs up when you have time limits to meet. EG Christmas...

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Neville
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Neville Bastian
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Re: New CN controller and Vr6

Postby Neville Bastian » Wed, Dec 16 2009, 9:36PM

Hi Thom,
Tried a 5.2 only generated program with the same results. Just have to wait for Larry to find the reason why.
Out of curiosity what is your ramp in length and plunge speed. I ask this because when it ramps in the size is correct then it jumps away 1mm on the top and bottom of the X axis. Second time it runs it comes in the same ramp but stays the correct path. Maybe their is a issue there? May as well give me the feed speed you use and the RPM of the bit. I will try and duplicate what you have to see the result.

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Neville
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Larry Epplin
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Re: New CN controller and Vr6

Postby Larry Epplin » Thu, Dec 17 2009, 3:37PM

Neville,

I have looked at the files Blake sent in. Unfortunately he only sent the job files and cnc files. From this limited information I can not see a problem. The parts are sized based on the edgebanding applied. I did notice that some of your parts have edgebanding on all sides while other parts have edgebanding on just 2 sides. This could be what you are seeing.

If this is not the case then the only way we will be able to see your problem is if you can get us a specific scenario to reproduce the issue. Here is what we need.

1.) 1 eCabinet job file containing the bad part.

2.) 1 Export file from Control Nesting when the job with the bad part is loaded

3.) Description of the part size that is incorrect (part name, wrong size, correct size)

If it takes a particular sequence of events to get the bad results please specify the steps.

Hopefully with all this information we can see what you are talking about. Please send the information to program@thermwood.com

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Neville Bastian
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Re: New CN controller and Vr6

Postby Neville Bastian » Thu, Dec 17 2009, 6:08PM

Thanks Larry for the reply. I will do what you ask but every ecabinets created program we run all parts are bad first time run. Second pass when we run the same sheet trims to correct size. Anyway I will do what you say.
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Neville
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Larry Epplin
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Re: New CN controller and Vr6

Postby Larry Epplin » Mon, Dec 21 2009, 10:18AM

The Export sent in has a job loaded that was not included in the emails. I am having a problem locating what your are talking about. Please offer me precise detail. With the Export Blake sent in I get the attached Sheet 2 results. He stated that the problem exists on the second sheet. So in this example we will use Part 2 as our test. Part 2 on Sheet 2 is the "Right End" from Cabinet "Unit 16 - Cab 2 - Cnr Unit" in job "3449 - Bethel - Unit 16 - Kitchen". The size it is cutting is 554mm along X axis and 747mm along Y axis. Is this correct or not?
Attachments
Sheet 2.JPG
Sheet 2.JPG (57.25 KiB) Viewed 2114 times

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Larry Epplin
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Re: New CN controller and Vr6

Postby Larry Epplin » Tue, Dec 22 2009, 9:57AM

Just another note on this issue. All the jobs that you have sent in for this have had edgebanding on the parts. The sizes are cutting correctly based on this edgebanding. Please insure your measurements are based on the part size giving allowance for edgebanding thickness.

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Neville Bastian
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Re: New CN controller and Vr6

Postby Neville Bastian » Tue, Dec 22 2009, 8:42PM

Larry,
I have no problem with sizing of parts. The problem I have is that I can only get the correct size by running the same nest the second time. It seems you are getting the parts cutting correctly first time on your test Thermwood. Not sure what to do now Larry? The code is correct, Our settings are correct on the controller. Its not mechanical as other non Thermwood software cuts the sizes correctly. The only problem I have is that I have to run the nest a second time?

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Neville
Neville Australia

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Larry Epplin
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Re: New CN controller and Vr6

Postby Larry Epplin » Tue, Dec 22 2009, 9:36PM

Ok. Lets do this. Run Control Nesting to create a cnc file the first time. Save this cnc file from THM and name it "first_run.cnc". Then run Control Nesting a 2nd time and save the cnc file. Name it "second_run.cnc". Post these files or send them to program@thermwood.com. We will look to see if there is a difference in the files.

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Re: New CN controller and Vr6

Postby Larry Epplin » Wed, Dec 23 2009, 1:21PM

We have received your files from running Control Nesting twice and there are no differences in them. So it appears the software is creating the programs correctly. Running Control Nesting twice doesn't appear to have made a difference. All we can do at this point is look at a cnc program that you claim is running incorrectly. If you can produce this then we need EXACT DETAIL on which part was cut incorrectly. Then we can look at the program to see if it is indeed incorrect.

Honestly, based on the information you have presented, it appears that the problem is either mechanical or operator error. We have not found a problem in any of the data you have sent.

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Neville Bastian
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Re: New CN controller and Vr6

Postby Neville Bastian » Thu, Dec 24 2009, 3:05AM

Hi Larry,
Thanks for looking at the files.
Its Christmas come summer holidays for us down under so will worry about the solution in the new year.
All the best to the Thermwood staff and thanks for the help through the year.
Now wheres that fishing rod.

Regards

Neville
Neville Australia

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Re: New CN controller and Vr6

Postby Will Williamson » Sat, Dec 26 2009, 12:42PM

What it sounds like to me is a mechanical issue. Where as on the first cut, the bit is pulling hard to one side making your part bigger than it should be. And then on the second pass where there is no side load to speak of, it cut the part sliglty smaller.

Try reversing the direction of cut and see if the part is cutting smaller on the first pass.
Will

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