negative number in fixture offset table
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Michael J Starry
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negative number in fixture offset table
Does the fixture offset table allow for negative numbers, or do they need to be a positive?
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Jason Susnjara
- Thermwood Team
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Michael J Starry
- Junior Member
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- Joined: Tue, Oct 03 2006, 9:40AM
- Location: Brainerd, MN
- Contact:
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Brad McIntosh
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RE:Negative Numbers in the Fixture Offset Table...
Hmmmm...
Seeing as values in the Fixture Offset Table normally refer to absolute distances away from the home position, they would normally be in the following ranges:
X Axis: 0 to Length of-table (a positive value)
Y Axis: 0 to Width-of-table (a positive value)
Z Axis: 0 to Surface-of-Table (a negative number \"downwards\")
This should be standard is for recent machines (last 12+ years) that follow the right hand rule.
Normally the Z would not be referenced (left blank) on standard 3 axis machines as the ZSHIFT variable (and WASTEBOARD in Control Nesting) combined with the DAYLIGHT measurement of the tool handles the Z reference for the part on the table. (You could define a Z value in the Fixture Offset Table, but the tool change macro would most likely redefine it when doing the DAYLIGHT/ZSHIFT calculation.)
The only time I could see negative values being used for either X and/or Y would be if a program was created with the body of the NC code so far off the table in either X and/or Y positive directions that you would have to set the part program origin behind the HOME position to bring the \"program\" back into the working envelope of the machine. I say normally, as usually the part program is created with a zero reference that is relatively close to the body of the part.
(Correction: A negative value COULD ALSO be used in either the X or Y to shift the part program slightly as long as it does not: A) Shift the program \"out of bounds\", or B) Shift the program into the ToolChanger \"NO GO ZONE\".)
Michael, what exactly are you trying to do with negative values in the Fixture Offset Table? What Model and controller series do you have? Perhaps I could help with the trouble shooting...
Seeing as values in the Fixture Offset Table normally refer to absolute distances away from the home position, they would normally be in the following ranges:
X Axis: 0 to Length of-table (a positive value)
Y Axis: 0 to Width-of-table (a positive value)
Z Axis: 0 to Surface-of-Table (a negative number \"downwards\")
This should be standard is for recent machines (last 12+ years) that follow the right hand rule.
Normally the Z would not be referenced (left blank) on standard 3 axis machines as the ZSHIFT variable (and WASTEBOARD in Control Nesting) combined with the DAYLIGHT measurement of the tool handles the Z reference for the part on the table. (You could define a Z value in the Fixture Offset Table, but the tool change macro would most likely redefine it when doing the DAYLIGHT/ZSHIFT calculation.)
The only time I could see negative values being used for either X and/or Y would be if a program was created with the body of the NC code so far off the table in either X and/or Y positive directions that you would have to set the part program origin behind the HOME position to bring the \"program\" back into the working envelope of the machine. I say normally, as usually the part program is created with a zero reference that is relatively close to the body of the part.
(Correction: A negative value COULD ALSO be used in either the X or Y to shift the part program slightly as long as it does not: A) Shift the program \"out of bounds\", or B) Shift the program into the ToolChanger \"NO GO ZONE\".)
Michael, what exactly are you trying to do with negative values in the Fixture Offset Table? What Model and controller series do you have? Perhaps I could help with the trouble shooting...
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Michael J Starry
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- Joined: Tue, Oct 03 2006, 9:40AM
- Location: Brainerd, MN
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To be honest... I have no idea! I am the newest programmer in our company, so I have just inherited this stuff and this is the first time in my life I have been involved with Thermwood Routers. Most of how they are set up is totally different from what I am used to. I worked as a service tech for KOMO for 2 years and worked for years previous to that setting up, running and programming them in a shop setting. This whole Thermwood thing is an entirely new monster to me.
Our set up guys just slap a fixture up on the table, anywhere they feel is good, then locate part zero and add that number directly into the program. I have been trying to get them to use the offset table with little to no success.
Somehow they are coming up with negative numbers, which is odd to me.
I did find one of our set up guys today who informed me that he always thought that machine zero was in one location, but realized it was in the opposite corner. This after 13 years with our company. and 8 of them setting up Thermwood routers.
SO as you can see, I am swimming upstream here.
I have not had any training on Thermwoods myself, though that is allegedly coming soon as we bought a new machine and I begged for the training.
I will be working with the set up guys very closely next week, so I should have a better idea what is happening out there and will post back then.
Thanks guys, for your help.
Our set up guys just slap a fixture up on the table, anywhere they feel is good, then locate part zero and add that number directly into the program. I have been trying to get them to use the offset table with little to no success.
Somehow they are coming up with negative numbers, which is odd to me.
I did find one of our set up guys today who informed me that he always thought that machine zero was in one location, but realized it was in the opposite corner. This after 13 years with our company. and 8 of them setting up Thermwood routers.
SO as you can see, I am swimming upstream here.
I have not had any training on Thermwoods myself, though that is allegedly coming soon as we bought a new machine and I begged for the training.
I will be working with the set up guys very closely next week, so I should have a better idea what is happening out there and will post back then.
Thanks guys, for your help.
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Michael J Starry
- Junior Member
- Posts: 29
- Joined: Tue, Oct 03 2006, 9:40AM
- Location: Brainerd, MN
- Contact:
Let me follow up on that last post.
My company is a lot like the fictional band Spinal Tap, who can not keep drummers... We can't keep programmers. I am the 5th in 3 years here.
I am using Mastercam X to program for a 5 axis Thermwood 91000 Super control.
Our parts are not larger than the tables, they are typically about 3x3 feet or less, and about 2 feet tall after fixturing.
In the world I came from there were very very rarely ever any type of negative offsets. But it seems to be a regular occurance here.
My company is a lot like the fictional band Spinal Tap, who can not keep drummers... We can't keep programmers. I am the 5th in 3 years here.
I am using Mastercam X to program for a 5 axis Thermwood 91000 Super control.
Our parts are not larger than the tables, they are typically about 3x3 feet or less, and about 2 feet tall after fixturing.
In the world I came from there were very very rarely ever any type of negative offsets. But it seems to be a regular occurance here.
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Brad McIntosh
- Guru Member
- Posts: 559
- Joined: Wed, May 18 2005, 6:59PM
- Company Name: CNC Automation
- Country: CANADA
- Location: St. Zotique, Québec, Canada
- Contact:
RE:Negative Numbers in the Fixture Offset Table...
Michael,
5 Axis.. hmmm... If the you require negative offsets in the X and/or Y axis' and you are using the Fixture Offset Table and a G52L# to access them, then it is most likely a case that your ToolPlane Origin in Mastercam is too far to the left and/or below your part (in a TOP down GView).
PM me and we can exchange email addresses. You can then ZIP up a MC drawing with toolpaths that exhibit this \"negative\" trait and send it to me. I can review it and give you some input. Perhaps you could also send me a program you have generated from this same drawing and I can them compare. (The NC code should also be ZIP'd.)
5 Axis.. hmmm... If the you require negative offsets in the X and/or Y axis' and you are using the Fixture Offset Table and a G52L# to access them, then it is most likely a case that your ToolPlane Origin in Mastercam is too far to the left and/or below your part (in a TOP down GView).
PM me and we can exchange email addresses. You can then ZIP up a MC drawing with toolpaths that exhibit this \"negative\" trait and send it to me. I can review it and give you some input. Perhaps you could also send me a program you have generated from this same drawing and I can them compare. (The NC code should also be ZIP'd.)