Flip Operations Fence

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Dave Burtchell
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Flip Operations Fence

Postby Dave Burtchell » Fri, May 05 2006, 7:55PM

Howdy,

We have a CS40. Those locators for the flip operation fence are really starting to annoy me. Can I use the pop up pins to locate the fence if I change the G902 coordinates in the M999 macro? (I think those are the right numbers). Is there any way to use flip ops without removing the wasteboard? There must be someplace I can add a \"+wasteboard thickness\" to the program.

Thanks,
Dave

Jeff Norris
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Postby Jeff Norris » Fri, May 05 2006, 8:02PM

you should be able to put your flip just about anywhere on the table. change your g901-g904 coordinats in your m999 and then set rolling nest to the proper g901-904 location. you may have to do a xshift or yshift depending on where you place your corner.

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Bill Rutherford
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Postby Bill Rutherford » Sat, May 06 2006, 5:17AM

Dave,
Short of manually editing the code, there is no where to automatically add for the wasteboard. This is actually something I have been going to ask about. Why does the wasterboard have to be removed for flips? We generally pin the corners of our wasterboard to prevent it from curling up. This makes it a pain to remove for flips, especially if the flip is only one or two parts. Could we get our choice of cutting flips with or without the wasteboard, possibly as a setting in rolling nest? A setting like this would save us time each and every week.
Bill Rutherford
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Jeff Norris
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Postby Jeff Norris » Sat, May 06 2006, 8:53AM

i never use a waste board, just restart the program and enter zero for the waste board and go to the flip opps

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Postby Forrest Chapman » Sat, May 06 2006, 9:07AM

Jeff,

I think what their saying is they want to use the wasteboard but the program default is 0 thickness and as far as I know there is no way to change this. I personaly don't have to move the wasteboard often because of the 5x12 table and I use 5x8 wasteboards for most cutting.

The problem that I forsee with useing your popup locators is that they take alot of abuse and are usually not acurate enough for a flip opp.

Forrest

Jeff Norris
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Postby Jeff Norris » Sat, May 06 2006, 2:02PM

oh i see, correct me if im wrong, the main idea of the waste board is that you can slide if off and slide on another so you can lable parts while the machine is running, and the side benefit is that your spoilboard will last longer? bill why not do away with the wasteboard if your are screwing it down anyway? a piece of ldf for the spoilboard doesent cost that much, i can go well over a year on one spoil board, contrary to what some others have said i am quite certain that you get better holding power without a wasteboard. hope im making sense, of course untill thermwood adds an allowence for the wasteboard and flip opps, you can change the zshift for each flip. actully if you have a code editor like cimco or preditor you can open the file and edit the whole program quite easily.

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Glenn Van Reason
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Postby Glenn Van Reason » Sun, May 07 2006, 3:40PM

We do this all the time, you need to scan the part then when it says to place the part, scroll down a little (say 4-5 lines) and you get to
SET ZSHIFT=16.5000
Edit this by hitting the tab key to be
SET ZSHIFT=16.5000+WASTEBOARD
it will use the wasteboard thickness that you specified at the start of the job.
NOTE: You have to do this for each and every flip operation, not just teh first one.
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Bill Rutherford
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Postby Bill Rutherford » Mon, May 08 2006, 5:58AM

Jeff,
Actually I ran for over two years without a wasteboard. Now that I have started using one, I will never go back. The wasteboard does increase hold down, not sure why, just sure it does. We usually fly cut a few times a week due to the type of parts we cut and the quality of cut we demand. Loading and unloading a 5' x 10' piece of 1/4\" is a whole lot easier the a 5' x 10' peice of 3/4\".

Glenn, I know we could manually edit the code, but that opens up the opportunity for error. Also, thanks to Thermwood we are way to lazy to actually manually program these days :lol:
Bill Rutherford

North Woods Manufacturing

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and Edge Banding

http://www.northwoodsmanufacturing.com

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Postby Rob Davis » Mon, May 08 2006, 7:54AM

Dave & All,
We zero our machine to the top of the wasteboard and we then never have to remove it for flip operations. You do have to set the wasteboard thickness to .001 when it asks you during programming the job because it won't take zero. We don't remove the wasteboard for unloading so it works for us.

We don't know why either but a wasteboard really helps in holding to the table.

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Postby Nick M Singer » Mon, May 08 2006, 7:55AM

Whilst we are on the subject of fly-cutting waste boards I have always been concerned about this process because of excessive air flow through the vacuum pump. It is a long process (especially on my 7 x 10 table) and I wondered what the rest of you feel about this because of possible damage to the pump?

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Postby Jeff Norris » Mon, May 08 2006, 8:07AM

i have some of the wasteboards that i got from thermwood and i dident seem to get better holding power from it, mabye i wil try it again, what kind of pumps are you guys using, i have some of the older turbine pumps but useally only have to run one of them, i have a 5x12 table.

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Bill Rutherford
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Postby Bill Rutherford » Mon, May 08 2006, 8:31AM

Busch 15 HP
Bill Rutherford

North Woods Manufacturing

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Michael Kowalczyk
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Postby Michael Kowalczyk » Mon, May 08 2006, 11:19AM

Hey Bill or anyone else,
Where are you getting your 5 x 10 x 1/4 MDF wasteboard? Who is the maunfacturer? is it Temple Solidium? I have had the hardest time getting 5x10x1/4\" down here in Texas. I even posted a request on planet Wood with no response. I called Temple direct and they said they are on allocation and not making any more right now. Any help would be appreciated.

I have been using Temple solidium 4x8x1/4\" for years on my C40 with a 5x8 table. I just put a 1'x8' piece of acrylic next to it when I run Ecabs.
Otherwise I use our own PVC grid we made that has a 4x8 area with 2\"x2\" grids for air flow and I can lay up a dedicted board or a 1/4\" MDF for prototypes and short runs. But now that I have the C42 with twin 5'x5' tables I need a 5x10 (to cut in half for 5x5's) to do prototypes and short runs.

Thanks,
Michael Kowalczyk, GM

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Bill Rutherford
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Postby Bill Rutherford » Mon, May 08 2006, 12:10PM

Michael,
I am buying 5x8 Uniboard through my local supplier. We cut mostly 4x8 sheets so it works fine. I was told 5x10 were special order - full skid lots only
Bill Rutherford

North Woods Manufacturing

Full service CNC Machining

and Edge Banding

http://www.northwoodsmanufacturing.com

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Jason Susnjara
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Postby Jason Susnjara » Mon, May 08 2006, 12:20PM

Hi Guys,

There should be a control nesting update soon, that will have a setting so that you can leave the wasteboard on the table when doing flip ops. In the meantime you can change the ZSHIFT value by .25 to accomadate the wasteboard. For example, if your ZHIFT is set to .75 just add .25 to that. This is done in the flip op area of the program.


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