Leuco tools

[Dave Burtchell]

Anybody try Leuco tooling?
We recently switched from Formica to Wilsonart laminates on our liteply material because our panel products supplier had trouble with the Formica adhering to the liteply product.
The wilsonart stuff is dulling our tooling almost immediately. The top laminate dulls a notch in the tool and then starts chipping the edge. A 3/8 2flute Faze tool lasts 1 sheet! A Vortex lasts 7-8 sheets. The Leuco rep says their tools should last 20x longer. Takes a while to get them so won't know for a couple weeks. This is driving our operator nuts, and I don't blame him. We're running 20,000 rpm/ 600 ipm. Crap, I just checked Vortex' chipload chart and they recommend 10,000 rpm for HPL. Maybe that's our problem. Should be 10,000 rpm/ 300 ipm. Funny thing is, we could cut the formica brand all day long at 20,000 and tools lasted a long time.
Any thoughts?

Thanks,
Dave

[Forrest Chapman]

Hi Dave, Even a cheaper tool should last 10 to 15 sheets if run properly. An XP series 3/8" comp tool from vortex will cut 75 to 100 sheets if run 18k rpm and 700 ipm. They cost about 60$ each I think.

Forrest

[Dave Burtchell]

Forrest,
We're using #3184m bits. I think it has to be the hpl.

Dave

[Dave Burtchell]

Where are you getting XP bits for $60 ?

[Forrest Chapman]

I purchase them from Vortex. I haven't bought any for 6 months though so I don't know what they cost now but I show that I paid 57$. I cut a fair amount of laid up material and the only one I notice to be harder than the rest is nevamar. Forrest

[Dave Burtchell]

The Vortex web site lists them for $97!

[Forrest Chapman]

Key word "list". You will get a discounted price for quantities. Now they have them in other sizes and types like downshears. Forrest

[Neville Bastian]

I watched this web seminar last week and it covered a few points on tool advancement. I found it interesting. Might be worth a look?
from web site
John Michel from Leuco Tools will present the concept of their revolutionary new "P" system of cutting tool technology. Mike Serwa from Vortex Tool Co., will present the latest advancements in standard carbide cutting technology. Mark Alster from Leitz Tooling will present the technology behind their new RipTec technology.

Moderator: Karl Forth, online editor, CabinetMakerFDM.com

This webinar is sponsored by Leitz Tooling, Leuco USA and Vortex Tool Co., and is part of the Center for Woodworking Innovation webinar series presented by CabinetMakerFdm.

http://cabinetmakerfdm.com/ViewWebinar.aspx?id=85482

Regards
Neville

[Brian Meiste]

Hi Dave,
We have had a similar experience with our tooling when we swtiched from Formica to Wilsonart. A 3/8" compression will only last 2-3 sheets. We are currently using a 3/8 chip breaker at 600 imp and 16,750rpm. We are getting about 12 sheets out of a cutter now. I'm currious about your findings and what you are currently using.
thanks.
Brian

[Dave Burtchell]

Brian,
We've been using Leuco tools now for about 9 months. Their 2 flute 3/8 compression bit. It's purple. The tech says it's for brand recognition only, doesn't help the cut. We have cut our speed down for prelam to 13,500 and our feed rate accordingly to 375 ipm. Takes a little longer, but it's a real nice edge. We're getting 30+ sheets per bit at the moment which is great for Wilsonart products.

Hope this helps,
Dave

[Michael Kowalczyk]

Two question for you P-lam guys.
1- Have you tried the Z oscillation on the controller?
2- Have you tried PCD bits?

We use a 1/2" PCD on 5/8" two sided MDF core melamine all the time and can get anywhere from 200 to almost 500 sheets sometimes, out of a bit. We are also cutting at 700 - 750 IPM and around 18500 - 19000 RPM. So I am just curious to see if anyone has tried or is using a PCD currently.

[Dave Burtchell]

Correction. Our operator tells me the first Leuco bit we tried (the only one we used to cut prelam exclusively ), we got close to 50 sheets.

We have been thinking about PFD. What brand do you use? Cost? Resharpen?

Dave

[Michael Kowalczyk]

Its a NAP bit that is called a DBSU aka Diamond Bit Single Use. Though it could be sharpened we don't. resharpening is so much, IMHO, and I have heard you never get the same life out of it plus since the diameter shrinks we would have to use the tool diameter compensation and I don't want to take the chance of a wrong # input. For the $25-$50.00 a resharpen may save, it is not worth it for us. Depends on how many you buy but they run around $200.00 USD+-