custom layout / part editor bug

mikesand · Post by **mikesand** » Thu, Aug 02 2007, 12:27PM

Al,

LOL. I assume that you are kidding, right? About half of my ecab sessions end with a crash, usually more of a non-responsive lock up. I have developed the \"ecab 6th sense\" for knowing when a crash is eminent, so sometimes I preform the preemptive system restart.

You now probably want to know how inadequate my computer is... It is a completely maxed out Dell M70. That is 2.24 Ghz, 2 gigs Ram, Quadro 1400 vid card and XP pro.

I also run no non-business software, so I keep the system as clean as possible. By the nature of the type of jobs I take I spend a LOT of time making modifications and PE cuts. I also use the 3D texture mapping area a lot for STL files created else where. Though this will be the first job that I am relying only on the Ecab \"2 1/2 D\" part editor for \"user created objects\". I know that the constant switching between all the areas (every where from the LDE to the drawer editor to the rendering utility and back to the layout) seems to create instability in the system. If I simply pick cabinets, re-size them and put them in the layout there are no issues. But the jobs I get typically have a lot of re-designing and tweaking involved.

I am not complaining, I have used the competitions software to know that they haven't created a fool proof product, even with a decade head start and millions of dollars more revenue to put into the development.

I save frequently but, I don't save different versions as a backup. On this job I have 3 different versions, but things change so much that the other versions are only good for the walls.

I am nervous about this job because It is the first time I will have the job CNC'd. I have a ton of concerns and questions about making sure my file is good to go. I will post them here and on the machine forum when I am done and the customer approves. It looks like I will have 35 to 40 sheets of plywood to cut! If this goes smoothly it will be a testament to the Ecab cooperative that Ken is dreaming of.

I thank yall again for your help,

Mike

Michael Rice · Post by **Michael Rice** » Thu, Aug 02 2007, 3:32PM

Mike Sand
I feel your pain brother. My current job is loaded with PE cuts and display cubes. I experienced exactly what you are going through. I'm also running the same computer. I understand the \"sixth sense\". I tried removing some of the walls and ceiling work that wasn't necessary in hopes of improving things, but it didn't help much as most of my work sessions continued to crash......\"Sorry eCabs has encountered an error and needs to close\" ! Oh well, I finally just gave up and took what I had to the client. Fortunately, they are a repeat customer so it wasn't too big of an issue. In spite of thees problems, I'm still amazed at how creative this program is, and I believe that one day these things will get worked out. I wish I could offer some help, but sorry.......your job looks very cool and I hope you'll post the renderings when you're done.......

Mike

Al Navas · Post by **Al Navas** » Thu, Aug 02 2007, 4:09PM

mikesand wrote:...LOL. I assume that you are kidding, right? About half of my ecab sessions end with a crash, usually more of a non-responsive lock up. I have developed the "ecab 6th sense" for knowing when a crash is eminent, so sometimes I preform the preemptive system restart...

Mike,

I am not kidding. My laptop is rock solid. I have yet to crash it while working on it at home. I did manage to crash it once during the 3-=day seminar I took from Dennis Englert. But NO crashes since then. And many times I have had eCabs open and working on it 10-12 hours in one single day.

I do a LOT of checking with Spybot, Ad-Aware 2007, and ErrorClean (a Registry cleanup tool. And I look at file fragmentation every week, and defrag if needed These four things keep my machine performing at its peak.

mikesand wrote:...You now probably want to know how inadequate my computer is... It is a completely maxed out Dell M70. That is 2.24 Ghz, 2 gigs Ram, Quadro 1400 vid card and XP pro...

I don't know that I would call it inadequate, Mike. I suspect it might be your video display card, but I don't know for sure. Maybe Dan or one of the other guys would be able to comment much more intelligently on this than I ever could.

mikesand wrote:...I also run no non-business software, so I keep the system as clean as possible. By the nature of the type of jobs I take I spend a LOT of time making modifications and PE cuts. I also use the 3D texture mapping area a lot for STL files created else where. Though this will be the first job that I am relying only on the Ecab "2 1/2 D" part editor for "user created objects". I know that the constant switching between all the areas (every where from the LDE to the drawer editor to the rendering utility and back to the layout) seems to create instability in the system. If I simply pick cabinets, re-size them and put them in the layout there are no issues. But the jobs I get typically have a lot of re-designing and tweaking involved...

That is pretty typical of my long workdays with the software, when I make the time to spend on it - other duties keep me from doing so regularly. If I leave for any length of time, I just shut down.

mikesand wrote:...I am not complaining, I have used the competitions software to know that they haven't created a fool proof product, even with a decade head start and millions of dollars more revenue to put into the development...

I know what you mean. Kerry put it very well some time ago - he said he spends time at other software vendors' forums as well, and sees many of the issues facing them, too. I don't do so, but I don't want to deal with that as well.

mikesand wrote:...I save frequently but, I don't save different versions as a backup. On this job I have 3 different versions, but things change so much that the other versions are only good for the walls...

Hard disk drive real estate is cheap, Mike. The incremental job saving is a good, sound strategy, and will let you recover from nasties. Not only that, but you can also freeze your serious stuff such as cutlists and CNC models on the last of the REAL saves, and THEN continue with the display and pretty stuff to show the client(s), without concern of not being able to run the job on the CNC. THIS is the real advantage of incremental job saving.

mikesand wrote:...I am nervous about this job because It is the first time I will have the job CNC'd. I have a ton of concerns and questions about making sure my file is good to go. I will post them here and on the machine forum when I am done and the customer approves. It looks like I will have 35 to 40 sheets of plywood to cut! If this goes smoothly it will be a testament to the Ecab cooperative that Ken is dreaming of...

Just one suggestion, Mike - PLEASE take it as such, as I don't have the router experience myself (but will soon): Would it make sense to run one of your cabinets fully through the CNC, just to make sure that you have properly prepared the job to do so? It might save you a lot of time in running the entire job in full at the router.

mikesand wrote:...I thank yall again for your help...

I think that much of the credit goes to Walker for being the first to suggest PE cuts being the culprit here.

Good luck with this job on the CNC machine!

Al

mikesand · Post by **mikesand** » Thu, Aug 02 2007, 5:36PM

Al,

Thank you for your help with this. Keep in mind that I am extremely grateful to yall for the help and to Thermwood for giving me this opportunity to take advantage not only of Ecabs but the entire cooperative network they have set up for us.

I was being facetious about my computers performance, I am certain that my issues are not performance related. I will try the reg cleaner you recommend, I already do the other things. I am running Norton Internet Security and I believe that it is robbing more resources than it should, it definitely slows down the startup. One thing that I know causes crashes is going into hibernate or standby then waking it up again. The more consecutive times I do it without a proper restart, the more unstable ecabs becomes. Granted it is probably an issue with Windows as much as anything else. But I only have this issue when running heavy modeling software.

I usually save the initial layout of walls and openings under a different version name then I complete the layout with appliances, counters, objects, textures, and all that pretty stuff for the client. For my own purposes I need to see the finished product while I am still perfecting the layout. On this job I went through three bar/island ideas until I found the right one. Same with the refer cabinet (what yall see now is only part of the idea). I had to add the counters, lighting and textures to be able to see what was best. After I am sure I like the overall design I save the job under another version name and remove all the unnecessary elements, stripping the layout down to the cabinetry. Then I start scrutinising each cabinet making sure the joinery is right, and changing the materials to match what I will actually use. For example because this job is paint grade I will be using three or four different materials for what the current file calls \"3/4 painted cream\" . Depending on weather the material is visible, structural, or interior cabinet parts I will use several different materials. After all the details of materials and joinery are done I run the nesting and job printing.

Just one suggestion, Mike - PL

What does that mean?

Thanks again,

Mike

Al Navas · Post by **Al Navas** » Thu, Aug 02 2007, 5:57PM

Sorry, Mike - I did not realize that I exceeded the limit for the post, and did not check it after posting.

What I wanted to say/suggest:

You might want to try cutting just ONE cabinet on the CNC machine, before submitting the entire job. This will give you an opportunity to learn if you did, in fact, set up the job correctly for the machine. And if not, you can then change the rest of the cabinets to make the rest of the job run well. This usually entails working closely with the shop that will cut the job for you.

I don't have a Thermwood router, but will get a chance to send a job and run it on the machine in the near future. And I am pretty certain that I won't have everything set up properly - this means that the owner of the machine will have to review the job to MAKE it run properly. I will be paying attention to the changes.

Good luck, and let us know how it goes once you do get it to the machine.

Al

Kerry Fullington · Post by **Kerry Fullington** » Thu, Aug 02 2007, 7:28PM

Mike,
Get rid of everything Norton as fast as you can. Try AVG. You will see a remarkable change.
If you have loaded and unloaded a lot of programs on your computer the registry cleaners help also.

Kerry

Rick Palechuk · Post by **Rick Palechuk** » Thu, Aug 02 2007, 7:57PM

I agree with Kerry. Since I switched to AVG I haven't had any general computer slow downs. I was running McAfee.

mikesand · Post by **mikesand** » Fri, Aug 03 2007, 11:42AM

Al,

The nearest production shareing option is about 250 miles away. So I plan to load it all up and drive out there to be with them while the job is cut. I was thinking about cutting one cabinet as well, however the cabinets all vary a lot from one another, and because of the mixed materials I might have to use more than one sheet to make one cabinet. But I will send the file to them first and see if they find a problem before I drive out.

I have heard about AVG, my Norton subscription expires soon, so I will look for it.

Mike

Michael Yeargain · Post by **Michael Yeargain** » Fri, Aug 03 2007, 4:19PM

Here is a link.

http://free.grisoft.com/doc/5390/us/frt/0?prd=aff

or a direct link

http://www.grisoft.cz/filedir/inst/avg7 ... 6a1048.exe

Thermwood / eCabinet Systems

custom layout / part editor bug

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